Charging Set Lightweight 80W

I am looking for a repair manual for "Charging Set Lightweight 80W", the small 1945 battery charger used in WW2 to charge radio batteries etc.
I think it was designed by Stuart Turner but was then made by many companies.

This is mainly so I don't break anything while restoring it back into working order.

I don't know if there is a repair manual, but the instruction book is at the bottom of this thread from the Historic Military Vehicle Forum.

http://hmvf.co.uk/topic/5903-charging-set-80-watts/

Thanks for that, but I had already found it. I cleaned it up and made a PDF of it too.
It was useful to see as the choke arrangements are non-obvious.

I think there is a repair manual but I have yet to find it.
Failing that, some general guide on torque settings would be good.

Ain't gonna be any torque settings, everything was just done up tight.

Well was it? I understand that it is rather easy to break things on this little set.

Actually, I am not sure how to estimate torque settings where it is not the bolt that is the issue, like studs in aluminium, especially the cylinder head - which I must remove to fix a bad valve. Any suggestions?

Measure the bolts/stud in mm and use the nearest metric torque setting?.

Thanks for that Stuart!

Robotstar5 wrote:Measure the bolts/stud in mm and use the nearest metric torque setting?.

This is fine on new components, I would definitely tighten with caution to the torque settings if you wish but be ready to say okay that's tight enough, depending on what and where and if the threads feel like they are going to give way just stop, how many times have our old engines been stripped in the past and by who, certainly no need to over tighten a lot of these bolts/nuts.

Chris

M0GXB wrote:Thanks for that Stuart!

It's only a guide, the Mk1 forearm is usually the best torque wrench for Aluminium

...and seeing your username are you also a ham?, de M0BTO.

> are you also a ham?
Yes.

> the Mk1 forearm is usually the best torque wrench for Aluminium
I just found a sheared stud so someone didn't find it so.

[quote="Robotstar5"]Measure the bolts/stud in mm and use the nearest metric torque setting?.

[url=https://servimg.com/view/20008529/296][img]https://i.servimg.com/u/f93/20/00/85/29/altorq10.jpg[/img][/url]
[/quote]

I'd probably trust that as far as I could throw it, it makes no allowances for thread pitch or anything, a BSF bolt would strip a lot sooner then a BSW I feel...

I have never torqued anything on any old engine and I'm not going to start now, if it was a diesel and had torque settings then I would but everything else will be done up finger tight plus 1/2 a turn, same as I always have done.

Villiers wrote:I have never torqued anything on any old engine and I'm not going to start now, if it was a diesel and had torque settings then I would but everything else will be done up finger tight plus 1/2 a turn, same as I always have done.

Can't beat experience

Sorry, but I do not understand "experience" in this context.

The only way you will know if you apply too much torque is because you break it.
If you did not break it then how do you know it was appropriately tight? It could too loose, which may take some time to cause a fault, or may not because in this case it didn't matter, or maybe dirt and rust stopped it falling apart as would have happened had it been clean and new.

To learn something by experience you need feedback. I am not seeing enough here.

It appears this little engine is showing me that someone has used it to experience too much torque, and now I get to fix it.

I see from torque tables that there is considerable variation according to the material grade of the bolt. I presume anything un-modern will be the lowest grade?

By the way, given English built and 1945 - what theads are most likely used?

BSW and BSF, but could be metric, experience can only be gained by you, not tight enough will cause less harm than over tightened and snapped, its easier to reassemble an engine with the studs, bolts or nuts needing a nip up after the first run rather than over tightening them 1, causing damage and snapping while assembly, 2 being a right pain the next time you go to pull it apart,
It can be surprising how little force is required to hold a nut and bolt together for general conditions, head bolts/studs obviously need more but even then your only going to loose compression or have a water leak if they are not tight enough.

Chris

Just to add my two penn'orth. None of the various manuals I have make any mention of torque. As to thread forms, BSW and BSF are very common also BSC (British Standard Cycle) and BA. I have had more than one engine where someone has mixed BSW and UNC.  Micrometer and thread gauge are worth investing in.

Bolts and studs can become 'waisted' causing them to shear off. So, when dismantling use plenty of propane, Plus Gas and patience. Took me three weeks of daily applications to free up a Villiers exhaust stud and that's quick compared with other threads on here.

> BSC (British Standard Cycle)
Yipes! Never heard of that. I had better look it up.

Yes, I have thread gauges for all the tap/die sets I have, mainly mertic, BSW and BSF. I even have a travelling microscope which I have used when I cannot match a thread to a gauge.

I know how hard it can be when a bolt gets distorted so that the thread now appears the wrong gauge.

Woodsman wrote:Just to add my two penn'orth. None of the various manuals I have make any mention of torque. As to thread forms, BSW and BSF are very common also BSC (British Standard Cycle) and BA. I have had more than one engine where someone has mixed BSW and UNC.  Micrometer and thread gauge are worth investing in.

Bolts and studs can become 'waisted' causing them to shear off. So, when dismantling use plenty of propane, Plus Gas and patience. Took me three weeks of daily applications to free up a Villiers exhaust stud and that's quick compared with other threads one here.

Just to throw something else in the mixer when mentioning BSW and UNC, the thread pitch on these 2 are the same up to 1/2" its the thread angle of 55deg and 60deg respectfully the only difference, I have used UNC where BSW were originally fitted, just don't tell the purists

Chris

> these 2 are the same up to 1/2"
Up to but not including...according to tables I have seen. (12tpi vs 13tpi at 1/2").
And there are small differences in the core sizes due to the different angles of course.

M0GXB wrote:> these 2 are the same up to 1/2"
Up to but not including...according to tables I have seen. (12tpi vs 13tpi at 1/2").
And there are small differences in the core sizes due to the different angles of course.

Experience tell me that they are close enough

Chris

Thing is, even with torque settings it doesn't mean you are not going to strip a thread, I know this as I did it once on a tractor I was rebuilding, the torque setting for the head nuts was followed but it still stripped one of the studs out of the casting, helecoil fitted and I got away with it.